# EP 07: Sunday Builders Club: The One Where the Next Corner Is 15 Minutes Away Part of "Omarchy! Omarchy! Omarchy!", the weekly Omarchy X Space. Every Sunday, 3pm EST, live on X. - Recorded: Sunday, October 25, 2026, 3pm EST - Length: 102 minutes - Speakers: 11+ - Tuned in: 129 - Hosts: @NixFred, @calledtocnstrct - Listen: https://x.com/i/spaces/1OxwbnXgpaEJB - Post on X: https://x.com/NixFred - Web: https://omarchyspaces.com/ep/07/ ## Summary (as posted on X by @NixFred) Sunday Builders Club, Episode 7: "The one where the next corner is 15 minutes away." Recorded Sunday, October 25, 2026. An hour and 42 minutes, 129 tuned in, 9 people came up to speak, and every one of them was building something. Listen: https://x.com/i/spaces/1OxwbnXgpaEJB Full write-up and the complete transcript: https://omarchyspaces.com/ep/07/ @calledtocnstrct Joe, show manager and co-host, and me @nixfred, co-host. Wes @ncfrontiersman was traveling this week, so Joe and I ran it together, splitting the interviews down the middle. Joe and I are the hosts but YOU are the star!!! In the order they spoke: Lee, Zach, DevSec, Heath, Compiling Things, Portia, Dan, Steve and John. Joe ran the speaker queue and kept everybody in the order they raised their hand. Thank you, brother! THE WEEK IN OMARCHY First thing I did was misname the Space. It said Nix's Space. This is not Nix's Space, this is the Builders Club. That is what you get when you do not have Wes. Fixed it live. Then the news, because you people do not sleep. Compiling Things put his wife on Omarchy this week, and DHH replied and asked for a list of everything she found annoying. Joe's take: you cannot get a human on a customer service line anymore, and here is DHH, and Ryan too, right there on the front lines on X taking feedback from the user of the user. @devsec_ai put out Uber TV 0.4, now with a DVR. I have been recording a lot of Rick and Morty, do not tell anybody. Omarchy is booting on the NVIDIA Shield as Omarchy TV Beta and DHH posted it. Omarchy 4.5 RC1 is out, the very first feature release since Quattro, with 50-plus languages. I put it on my laptop with a 45-inch monitor, and the thing that jumped out was floating spaces that dock. I am not sold. Joe sees it as an on-ramp. Once the keybindings clicked for him, he stopped reaching for the mouse to hunt for the little arrow and drag and resize, and it freed up his ability to think. He does not think that is all AI. There is something special in how Omarchy is put together, and keeping drag and drop around lets newcomers make the jump slowly. The agent panel went from 9 to 23 agents in one press of the Enter button. DHH said "just put an Omabot on it," and half an hour later Omabots were posting in CI about unintended encrypted installs that same morning. Omarchy QA now runs against the nightly every single day, and right behind that DHH posted about the hours spent manually testing and verifying releases in the first year. Joe has been raiding his junk drawer. He reverse-engineered a Tobii eye tracker that was locked to approved games, and now he is eyeing his Chromebook Slate. LARRY GOT A BOSS Last week Larry moved into Grok Bot. This week Anthropic shipped Claude Code connectors, so Grok Bot now manages Claude Code for me. Grok Bot is my connector to Gmail, calendar and 40-something other connectors. When I start a project I make a new bot, tell it to go to my machine, into Herder, through the Claude Code connector, and I tell it: you are not coding this, Larry is. Larry has 10 months of my settings, and Grok Bot types into the session like a third party. Best of both worlds. Joe is doing the same thing with his mouth. He sat at lunch in Grok Bot voice mode with his eyes closed and talked through what he wanted his team to build. Grok Bot files and manages the issues on his GitLab server, and a Grok build team runs in a loop that checks what is ready, pulls it in and spins off sub-agents. He just imagines it and discusses it. WHERE DOES IT GO FROM HERE? That was the question for the room. Joe called it fog of war, minus the war. It is a period of extreme potential and bloom, and the haze keeps getting closer. My take: when software took six months, you announced it and had six months to think about what came next. Now somebody tweets at 8 AM that they will ship a CRM tonight and it is out by 9:30. You cannot see beyond the next corner because the next corner is 15 minutes away. @NotJustShaking Lee is my boy, and he showed up with six things. Part one of his Omarchy and Waveshare article is on his Substack, link in his bio, and part two is underway. It is about making it easier for people with disabilities and cognitive issues to control the Omarchy desktop from what is in essence an iPad. Basti invited him onto his podcast, they recorded an hour yesterday on Lee's switch to Omarchy, and it comes out in two weeks. He is building the Wired Differently vault for Omarchy for Different Minds, an Obsidian vault that Claude or Codex builds for you through a set of questions, and he is testing it on an old iMac he put Omarchy on, with a Chromebook and an old ThinkPad next. Grok Bot has access to his vault step by step, and Grok and his ChatGPT assistant talk to each other through Markdown files so they do not double up. Please follow Lee and subscribe to his Substack. Give him a little more voice. @ZryMiller Zach has spent two months on Sotto, his own agent development environment, and its Watcher feature. The problem: a thread hits a question buried in its reasoning summary and sits idle for hours. Watcher hooks into your subscriptions, puts a model on watch over your threads, brings Zach only the questions and permissions, and keeps everything else moving. Its biggest job is a CI queue for PR merges so agents stop stepping on each other. It keeps a notepad outside compaction and checks in on any thread idle for 20 minutes. Next is orchestrating across machines over Tailscale, handing a thread to another box when the CPU loads up or a test needs linux. It runs on Windows, macOS and Omarchy, has an iOS app and dictation built in, and it is fully open source, link in his bio. I asked if the frontier labs will just ship this. Maybe a month, maybe six, but he does not want his work running on someone else's cloud computer. @devsec_ai Martin called in from a car. We are in the early stages, resetting the foundation the way the 90s internet and Web 2.0 did, and this is a new stack. The frontier labs will integrate a lot, but what they ship are defaults, and defaults always need customization. That should empower you. Security is the key, and expect friction: walled gardens and terms of service fights, like eBay banning sellers for stupid reasons in the early e-commerce days. He also had his agent flag omarchystore.com as a possible scam. My update: they shut the store down, said "we heard you," are removing anything with elevated permissions and are reviewing every listing. Give them grace. Then the Shield. A 2017 NVIDIA Shield, Tegra X1, 48 hours of 16 to 18 hour days, writing drivers for sound, GPU acceleration and thermal management. Agents did a lot of it, but hardware means plugging and unplugging. Next up is a Surface Pro 4 with the touchscreen working and a desktop mode and tablet mode that switch when you dock and undock. DHH is eager to see it. @MuchmoreIT I have known Heath 20 years. He did mission planning for the F-117 stealth fighter on Cray supercomputers. Today he is working with a 2.8 trillion parameter model, 105 billion active, that needs 72 GPUs for a single instance. I asked if I can run it on my 5070. Once it is quantized, maybe. His advice: GPU memory matters most, but you do not need the newest card, because models keep getting squished. Download LM Studio and start pushing models. He has an engine waiting on legal clearance, and he wants to bring the manager of managers down to size: one Omarchy box coordinating Azure, AWS, GCP, Oracle and your local server. He says his company is the only one authorized to install Google TPUs on premises. I told him I have a Best Buy credit card. That will buy me a couple minutes on the TPU. He has more ideas than time, so reach out and he will throw you one. @Compilethings Joe asked how he sees the road ahead. He sticks to his system and lets the noise settle. His system is an orchestrator of orchestrators in Claude Code: seven sessions, session one hands out the work and holds the context, and compact, startup and shutdown skills keep it all alive. It ran for a week while he was in Poland and he checked it twice a day over remote desktop. They do not stop. A GitHub release with a one-click test and an article is coming within about two days, and he wants Zach to pick it apart. He prefers criticism. He runs an all-AMD rig of R9700s for local inference, and his wife uses it for legal work she wants off the internet. Omarchy lives on his T480. He plays on both sides, open and closed. "I see open source video games as good as the main publishers. We can adapt like humans do." @letsbuildanyway Portia talks to a lot of people who are not developers, and she wants to know which of this tech someone who does not like to tinker will actually adopt, and what stays a hobby. Her bet: the biggest technology is UX and how workflows change, and the hardest part is how corporations are structured. Her latest video is on local models, downloading one with Hermes and finding out what her hardware can really do. She also said we underestimate how many people want someone to tell them what to do, and that freedom can feel like a threat. Joe tabled that one for a future call. Portia, you are one of the teammates. @dsegan Dan has been in tech since the late 90s, Sun Solaris, HP-UX, early Slackware. He came to Omarchy before Quattro to build a hacker workstation in his basement workshop next to a Commodore 64. He is building a Lucasfilm-style adventure game about his friends' punk comedy band. His day job is at a hyperscaler that also sells an office suite, where enterprise AI adoption is the Wild West, and software development was never the hard part. He handed Grok Bot an API key to his UniFi setup and it fixed his radios, the UPnP broadcasts and the printer chatter. Network retries went to zero. On the way to buy a NAS he talked to it from his car and had it SSH in and get everything ready. "It felt really Star Trek." He runs a Cleveland-area Omarchy meetup in Beachwood, Ohio, the last Thursday of the month, which is this Thursday. He was the only one at the first one. Go! @_fromahuman_ Steve spent 25 years in tech, Microsoft and servers, and in 2018 he and his wife packed up the two kids, bought an RV and traveled Europe, Bali and Mexico. Then they bought land and lived in a tent for about a year to learn the water and the sun, gardened before they built anything, and now have a cabin, a proper solar setup and a house under construction. He has been learning linux since 2018 and his kids are on linux laptops. Somebody mentioned Omarchy a third time, he dual-booted it, and two or three months later it is on every laptop he owns. Updating each machine in person got painful, so he is building a client and server CLI, a fleet manager for Omarchy: list your machines and their skills, copy skills between them, update them remotely, and secure it all with per-machine tokens that can be read-only or admin. PXE boot is next. He uses a different agent per project so context does not get contaminated, and keeps coming back to Hermes for its bridge mode across machines. @drxiaozhi John is building something unconventional: a whole JavaScript stack with Bun as PID 1, so the same source runs on Windows, Android and linux without a binary for every system. This week he is rewriting QuickShell in JavaScript and getting as many Omarchy apps running on it as he can. And yes, JavaScript, not Java. Joe closed it out. He gave DHH credit for the leadership through all of this, and said he never realized how locked down the computing world was, and here he is writing software. Then he quoted DHH: "I don't want another business that serves customers." Build something because it is fun, because it helps somebody, because it builds a community. If you are not feeling connected in this community yet, DM him. My last word: everybody here is here to learn. No judgment, no egos. Heath works on 100,000 GPUs and he is about as humble as they come. Every one of you is the star. ASKS ON THE TABLE Follow everybody in the room and boost each other. I followed everyone I could find and X rate limited me. Follow Lee and subscribe to his Substack. Try Sotto, Zach's open source ADE. The link is in his bio. When Compiling Things drops his orchestrator on GitHub, run the one-click test and tell him what is wrong with it. He prefers criticism. Heath has more ideas than time. Reach out and he will throw you one. Cleveland area? Dan's Omarchy meetup is in Beachwood, Ohio, the last Thursday of the month. That is this Thursday. Not feeling connected yet? DM @calledtocnstrct and get connected. QUESTIONS STILL OPEN Q1. Where does it go from here? When the next corner is 15 minutes away, how do you plan past it? Q2. Portia's question: which of this will regular people actually use, and which stays a hobby for tinkerers? NEXT SUNDAY Same time, 3PM EST on X Spaces, and Wes is back! @Chronara_ai got dropped before their turn, so come back! If you did not get to speak today, we are sorry, please come back! And remember! Help an old lady across the street, and when you get her over there, put Omarchy on her laptop. Your only limitation now is not putting it in a prompt. /Nix and Larry ## Transcript Machine generated. Speaker labels come from the transcription tool and are reused for different people; the summary says who is who. @NixFred: Fred, everyone, how's it going? @calledtocnstrct: Hey, hey, hey. I think it's time. We're getting close. @calledtocnstrct: How you doing, Claude? @calledtocnstrct: It's a beautiful day. Just getting the, uh, sound set up here. @calledtocnstrct: Can you hear me all right? @NixFred: I hear you great. What about me? @calledtocnstrct: Yeah, likewise. Sounding good? @NixFred: Uh, you sound fan- fantastic. Don't need to turn it up. @calledtocnstrct: Audio's good for me. Uh, I can hear you loud and clear. @NixFred: All right. Well, uh, fantastic. I think we've got one more week. @NixFred: Let's, uh... we've got some people requesting to speak. If you're out there, I see a lee. @NixFred: Um, that's what Claude is here to help us with. And, uh, he will... he will, uh, set the stage for us. @NixFred: So, uh, just stand by, Lee. Can't wait to talk to you, man. @NixFred: It's been a minute. I apologize for missing our meeting this week, man. @NixFred: I've been cooking. @calledtocnstrct: It's been a busy we- week, hasn't it? @NixFred: It really has. It's impossible to keep up with all the news. @NixFred: All right. Well, let's get this thing started, Claude. @NixFred: What do you think? @calledtocnstrct: Yeah, I think so. Especially... @NixFred: Or do we... or do we wait a minute? Let's... let's give it a second. I'm a little early, and there's... let's let a couple of folks build in here. @NixFred: Maybe one minute? With your approval? @calledtocnstrct: Yeah, that'll work. @NixFred: All right. @NixFred: Wow, that's, um... you're right. We got RC1s out. @NixFred: We got, uh, people are putting it on PS5s, shields, TVs, iPads. Did I miss anything? @NixFred: Arm laptops? @calledtocnstrct: Yeah. It's, um, the... the variety is crazy. Uh, I'm... I think I'm creating a little bit of an echo, though. @NixFred: All right. Well, let's make... let's see if it's me. @calledtocnstrct: Yeah. I just, um, it was hard to keep up with all the news. Um, you know, not just the... the... the new, uh, machines. @calledtocnstrct: I mean, they're looking at Android, uh, you know, tablets and... and phones, and it's just... just incredible. @NixFred: Crazy. @NixFred: All right, brother. Let's get it rolling. @NixFred: All right. Welcome, welcome, welcome to the Omarchy X Spaces called Omarchy Sunday Builders Club. @NixFred: It was started by Wes, and, uh, he is traveling this week, folks. So, uh, all you're going to get is me and, and, uh, called to... I... I... I want to call you CTC, but that's what I call Cinnamon Toast Crunch. @NixFred: So I don't know if you... @calledtocnstrct: Yeah, you could also call me Joe. Uh, Joe works so fine as well. @NixFred: I wouldn't... I wouldn't going to call you out because I didn't... some people hide their identity. I didn't know if you were Superman. @calledtocnstrct: No. I wish, but, uh, no, that's good. Uh, and called to construct. @calledtocnstrct: That's what I've used for... for decades, so. @NixFred: Where'd that come from? @calledtocnstrct: Uh, just I... I love to build things. And I looked around at everything I was doing, and, you know, whether it was like team building at work, or, you know, building software, or build... I used to be part of a... a Lego club, and, you know, adults, uh, would get together and build big buildings and train layouts. So everything was about building, constructing. @calledtocnstrct: That's where it came from. @NixFred: Uh, now I understand your love for Omarchy. @calledtocnstrct: That's right. Exactly. @NixFred: Yeah. All right, folks. So welcome. @NixFred: Episode 7, Sunday Builders Club. Please follow @SundayBuildClub. @NixFred: I'm Nix, Nix Fred on X. Wes is out traveling this week, and Claude can... or Joe and I... I don't know how I'm going to... where I'm going to land on that. @NixFred: Joe and I are, uh, running the show today, so raise your hand, and he's going to get you set up on the stage. We got one less host talking, which means more mic time for you guys. @NixFred: So let's talk about what's happened this week. Last week, Compilethings was here talking about datasets, and on Tuesday, he put his wife on Omarchy. @NixFred: I then later saw that DHH replied, "Man, is he involved?" And he's asked for a list of everything that she found annoying, which I think is cool. @NixFred: Like, Joe, when is the last time a software manufacturer reached down to a user? And not... not only reached down to a user, but reached down to get the user of the user's opinion. @calledtocnstrct: Right. Right. I mean, you know, how can you even get a hold of, uh, customer service anymore? @calledtocnstrct: It's always, you know, it's a bot or something. And... and unless, uh, DHH is tricking us somehow. @calledtocnstrct: Man, he is, uh, right there on the front lines. Ryan's on the front lines, uh, posting on... on X, you know, getting feedback. @calledtocnstrct: It's just incredible. @NixFred: That's right. That's right. And let's see here. @NixFred: Uh, Omarchy, for the rest of us, shipped her first contribution to Omarchy. I saw that. @NixFred: @devsec_ai put out Uber TV 0.4, now with a DVR, which is... I've been recording a lot of Rick and Morty, but don't tell anybody. Uh, let's see what else we got. Then, uh, Omarchy is now booting on the NVIDIA Shield. @NixFred: So you people do not sleep. This is insanity. @NixFred: Like, Joe, for real, what... I think Omarchy is on our second month? Tenth... tenth week, maybe? @NixFred: And... @calledtocnstrct: I know. @NixFred: Legit... legitimately, put this in perspective of, like, 2022 and all the advancements we've made. I mean, are we not sitting on, like, I don't know, five years of advancement? Like, in a 2022 span of technology advancements, which is just, what, three, four years ago, the time it would take to get all that done would have been, I don't know, several... and what I mean by that is, like, not getting it done, but just, like, every single day. @NixFred: I mean, I know a lot of you out there do too, but I'm... I'm working on this, uh, feverishly, and I can't stop, and I almost, like, wonder if I got a problem. But I... I know that I spend 10 hours a day, 7 days a week on this stuff, and I feel like I am completely behind, and I have no idea what's going on. @NixFred: What... what about you guys? What about... what about you, Joe? @calledtocnstrct: Yeah. I mean, it's... it's... it's, uh, every time I talk to somebody and I start telling them about Omarchy, and I'm thinking, you know, and... and the AI integration and everything going on. Like, you know, some of the projects I'm seeing, I... I have to stop and think, like, how long... how long has this been? @calledtocnstrct: Has it been, like, two years yet? Because it feels like that much innovation. @calledtocnstrct: And then I'm like, five weeks. You know? @calledtocnstrct: I was talking to a guy, and he said, you know, he picked up Omarchy, like, uh, uh, you know, three weeks ago or four weeks ago, and he started writing code, you know? And it... it's really jarring to think of that because software development has notoriously taken a long time just understanding what you want, then figuring out how to... how to make it happen, how to deploy it, all that. @calledtocnstrct: And it is just, uh, light speed right now. @NixFred: It really is. I mean... I mean, is that AI? Like, I've been watching... you know what I just noticed? @NixFred: I didn't name the, uh... I didn't name the space correctly. Should we, uh, should we restart it and name the space? @NixFred: Because this is not Nix's space. This is the Builders Club. @NixFred: Crap. I'm a moron. @NixFred: That's what you get when you don't have Wes. Let me see if I can edit it. @calledtocnstrct: I... I didn't even notice. @NixFred: Yeah. Okay, cool. I can edit it. @NixFred: Sunday... pay no attention to the idiot on the keyboard, folks. Builders Club. @NixFred: Such a rookie. All right. @NixFred: Cool. All right. @NixFred: So thanks for joining. Sorry about that. @NixFred: Um, that's literally what happens when Rus... when Wes is not here to keep us tight. So let's move on. @NixFred: So Omarchy 4.5 RC1 came out. Um, it's the very first feature release since Quatro. @NixFred: It's got... I think it's got 50-plus languages. And the coolest thing... I put RC1 on my laptop with a big 45-inch monitor, and the coolest thing that I saw... I don't know if you've run it yet... yet, uh, Joe, but the floating spaces that dock? @NixFred: Eh. I don't... you know, I got... one of the things when I go back to my Mac is that I spend 15% of my time organizing Windows, and... and I don't know how I feel about the floating spaces. @NixFred: What do you... I think it's an attempt to bring in the newcomers. What do you think, Joe? @calledtocnstrct: I think that's exactly it. Um, you know, I... one of the things that really appealed to me after I got used to Omarchy... uh, Omarchy, so, you know, like, uh, two, three weeks in, and I started to... the... the key bindings started to click for me, and I could go into the config files and... and tweak things a little bit. Um, I... I realized how much time I wasn't spending moving over, grabbing the mouse, you know, trying to figure out where this little arrow is, you know, @calledtocnstrct: and then... and then pinpointing exactly where I wanted to click and drag and resize Windows. And it just freed me up. My... uh, freed up my... my ability to think so I could focus on really what I wanted to do. @calledtocnstrct: So there's definitely a part of that. You asked, you know, is this all AI agency? @calledtocnstrct: And I don't think it is. I think there's something special. @calledtocnstrct: Uh, and it's not just Hyperland, but it's the combination of how things were put together. And, you know, I really think that we're going to start to see this, uh, innovate across the industry, across Linux open source. @calledtocnstrct: We're going to start to see some of this... these productivity gains incorporated into other spaces. And... and I think, you know, the... the maintainers are doing the right thing by making the... the option to transition slowly over to the high productivity of... of the, you know, key bindings and the Hyper... Hyperland and all that, um, by having the... the, you know, kind of drag and drop still be available. @NixFred: That's right. That's right. Let's see here. @NixFred: So what... did you hear about the NVIDIA Shield TV coming up? Uh, DevSecAI, I don't know if he's on. @NixFred: I hope he is. Maybe he can talk about it. @NixFred: Got, um, Omarchy running on... or maybe it was, uh, an Omarchy plugin, I'm not sure, on the Omarchy Shield. Um, his... his, uh, GitHub account is, uh, let's see, Marcho, M-A-R-C-H-O, 78, with Omarchy Shield. @NixFred: He said it was pretty challenging. And then, uh, DHH tweeted it out and said, "Omarchy on the NVIDIA... on the NVIDIA Shield." @NixFred: Um, so it's not a port launcher, from what I can tell. He shipped it as, uh, the Omarchy TV Beta, which is a kind of an Omarchy-style launcher for Android TV. @NixFred: And that just hearkens back again to all of the, uh, you know, we were talking before about all the devices that people are putting it on now. We've got... I don't know about you, but I... I've started going through my box, and I'm kind of jonesing for the next big thing I can work on. @NixFred: I... I don't know if you guys are feeling that too. One of the things I'm kind of running out of is ideas. @NixFred: Maybe it's just me, or maybe I'm burned out, but I started going through my junk... junk drawer and looking for, okay, can I hook to this? Does this have a way to come in, you know, to get into it? @NixFred: Have... have you reversed anything yet? @calledtocnstrct: Well, I... I did reverse, uh, the, uh, Eye Tracker, the Toby, you know, it's kind of like a gaming device, and it was locked down to just the... the games that, you know, were approved for it. And I was ab... you know, well, my agent was able to... to reverse engineer it. And that was my... my first, uh, attempt at hardware. @calledtocnstrct: And then I got to thinking, like, I've got this, uh, Chromebook, um, uh, tablet, the Chro... uh, Chromebook Slate, and it's a great machine. It's an i... i7, you know, quite a bit of, uh, RAM and disk space. @calledtocnstrct: And so I was like, huh, I wonder if anybody's started on this. And sure enough, like, people were chiming in, "Hey, so-and-so's working on this. @calledtocnstrct: Like, you need to connect with them." And so, you know, somebody's ahead, but, uh, it gives me hope that, uh, that I can then, you know, kind of resurrect that thing and... and start using it again because it's been kind of locked down in... in Chromebook space, and I just can't do the things that I want to do with it. @calledtocnstrct: And... and so, I mean, it's an incredible time, uh, to be looking at hardware, looking at software in a completely different way. @NixFred: It really is. Uh, I... I saw yesterday DHH merged PR 14.0 for something? 4.0? @NixFred: And so the agent panel went from 6 to get this to 23 collectors now. 23. @NixFred: I mean, there's... @calledtocnstrct: Wow. @NixFred: OpenScope, Cloud Armies, Ollama, OpenRouter... I'm trying to think of the more obscure ones. DeepSeek, Devin. So from 9 to 23 in... in one press of the Enter button. @NixFred: So all the agents are getting... are getting my shims now, so they find the tools after the launch, and they can literally just come up on it. So he said, "Just put an Oma... Oma bot on it." @NixFred: Say that word. So half an hour later, we get Oma bots posting information in CIs for unintended encrypted installs that same freaking morning. @NixFred: I mean, like, this is insane. @calledtocnstrct: Wow. You know, and there... @NixFred: And... go ahead. @calledtocnstrct: I was just going to say that's kind of been a... a secondary passion of mine is, um, you know, having the ability to... to... to go to a company and say, "Look, you know, you could get a lot more productivity across your entire organization with, uh, Omarchy, you know? Um, here... here's all of these features that it provides." And one of the... you know, one of the key things is, like, automated installs or, you know, just, uh, you know, being able to kind of lock things down @calledtocnstrct: so that you don't have, you know, vulnerabilities and security concerns. And look at this. I mean, it's just popping up left and right. @NixFred: Insane. Insane. So then the Permagen posted, uh, a couple... maybe even yesterday... that his Omarchy Q&A now will run against the nightly every single day. @NixFred: And then right behind that, DHH posted, and it's kind of funny. He says, "You wouldn't believe the hours he spent manually testing and verifying Omarchy releases during the first year." @NixFred: So you talk about human improvement and automating things. You know, we're... we're in a... and I talked to my friend Heath. @NixFred: I think Heath is on here. I saw his name. @NixFred: He... Heath works on, like, legitimate large enterprise, 100,000 GPU systems. And, you know, we've... when I first started using Claude Code, it was kind of important to me to kind of watch it as it went by and go, "Wait a minute. @NixFred: I don't know if I want you doing that." And I don't know if it's... the output's gotten to be too much or if it's gotten better, but this past week, I actually moved to let GrokBot manage my Claude Code through Claude Code connectors. @NixFred: And Claude Code connectors is a new feature that, you know, they're releasing features every 15 minutes now. So if you're using GrokBot or any other type of, uh, bot management system, you can now have it manage Claude Code through their Claude Code connector. @NixFred: So how that works for me now is... is every... I think folks know about Larry. Um, Larry's my AI that I've been working on since January 8th of this year. @NixFred: And it was really hard for me to grow GrokBot, and I really was... I was really... I was really liking GrokBot. Not... I don't use GrokBot to, like, say, make applications as much, and I know that a few of you do, and I think it does it pretty well. @NixFred: GrokBot, for me, is more of my connector. Like, it knows my Gmail, it knows my calendar, and I... I literally think I have 40-something connectors, which might be a problem, uh, but here we are. @NixFred: So, you know, I was going back and forth between GrokBot and going over to Claude Code and Herder. And, you know, I've got a project for each one of my little projects so that I don't have to remember what directory it's in. @NixFred: Because typically, when I have an idea, I just create the directory and start working on it, and then it becomes a name, and then I can't change the name of that directory. So Herder, for me, is very nice that I can rename that project, and I don't have to remember what directory it is. @NixFred: So I was switching back and forth between GrokBot and Claude Code with Larry, and I read through the updates over at Anthropic that they now had the Claude Code connector. And so now what I'm able to do is I create... once I've kind of got a project established with Larry, once I have that established, I go into GrokBot and I make a new bot, and I tell it, "You're going to be my counsel," or we're going to kind of bounce the ideas off each other. @NixFred: I want you to go over to my machine, Gus, and go into Herder, and go into the project called whatever it is that I'm working on, and use the Claude Code connector to connect to that. So what that does now is I can go into GrokBot and have conversations about what I want, and then I tell GrokBot, "You're not coding this. @NixFred: Larry is." And why would I do that? @NixFred: Because Larry... I've been writing stuff with Larry for almost 10... over 10 months, and he... he understands my... my wants, my... the settings that I like, and I don't have to tell him, and I don't want to retrain Grok. But Grok's really good about talking to me about it. @NixFred: So Grok knows that I... we discuss things, and then when it's time to send it to Larry, he... I can go over into Herder and look at that project, and he liter... GrokBot managing that project literally goes into that Herder session, and he's like the third party, and I see him typing, and he literally just cuts and pastes in there, and it's beautiful. And it's kind of the best of both worlds. @NixFred: Are you doing anything like that? @calledtocnstrct: Well, interesting that... that you said that, because, um, what I just realized, like, two days ago, is that the GrokBot, when you're in the app, not the integrated, uh, into X, um, which is another thing that we should probably, uh, chat for just a second on, but, uh, when you're in the... the GrokBot app, you can then use the voice integration. And so the other day at lunch, uh, I just needed my eyes to rest. I put the phone on the table, uh, activated the... the voice @calledtocnstrct: mode, and started talking, uh, through voice, and just could close my eyes and actually visualize what I wanted my team to build. Now, I'm not going directly to the... to the, uh, let's say, AI team, but, um, what I did was I... I, uh, connected GrokBot to my GitLab server and had it create issues and manage the issue state and make sure that the team is... is, you know, properly moving the tickets and things like that. And then I have my, uh, Grok build team set up @calledtocnstrct: with a... a kind of like an infinite loop where it just checks what's ready, pull it in, spin off some subagents. And the... the freedom that that has given me has been incredible. So now I can actually just imagine what I want, discuss it, uh, through voice with GrokBot, and then GrokBot says, "Oh, do you want me to open some... some, uh, issues for that?" @calledtocnstrct: I'm like, "Yes, I do. Thank you very much." @calledtocnstrct: And it's been. @NixFred: That's my... I don't like that. Now, if I... if I told you you would be doing the things that you're doing today, say, three years ago, would... I mean, that would be like, like Spaceman crazy lane. Am I right? @calledtocnstrct: Exactly. @NixFred: I mean... @calledtocnstrct: Exactly. @NixFred: And... and you know what? My mentor told me the other day. He goes, "Humans have this thing where we think we've arrived and it's over, and we've kind of done what we're doing, and we... we look at our progress and we go, 'Great, we... we're here.' @NixFred: And... and we have a hard time as humans to go, 'Okay, this isn't it. It continues.' @NixFred: Because we're so... you know, all of us as humans are... are... we only have the perspective of our own, uh, eyes and the people that we are." So we all know that it's going to get better, but I... I... I honestly, I can't... I can't think of, like, what the hell is... is next. @NixFred: I mean, legitimately. I mean, I remember, you know, I'm... I'm slowly letting go of the Claude Code have to read everything. @NixFred: And when I say read everything, it means, like, watch it go by. And... and where does it go from here? @NixFred: So that's my challenge and my question that we want to ask everybody that we talk to. Where does it go from here? @NixFred: So what do you think, Joe? @calledtocnstrct: Yeah. I think that's... I mean, that's an excellent question. And it's kind of, you know, there's this concept in... in gaming, you know, that you say kind of fog of war. @calledtocnstrct: Um, it's not a war. We're in... we're in a period of extreme, uh, potential and... and bloom, you know, as... as we've been talking about. @calledtocnstrct: But there is that kind of haziness, like, and the haziness is getting closer where, you know, where our vision, our clarity of vision used to be further out, potentially, and we might get it wrong at times. @NixFred: Right. @calledtocnstrct: But now it's... it's gotten closer. And so, yeah, I'm... I'm super excited to hear what people have, uh, on... on their mind with regards to that. @NixFred: I just kind of had an epiphany about the clarity of mind of the future and how it's getting harder, and I think I understand a little bit. And this is my take, and this is 15 seconds old in my mind. So when things took six months to accomplish, you had to... you had to announce what you're doing. @NixFred: Here's what we're going to work on. It's going to take us six months. @NixFred: We're going to really work hard on it. And so you had six months' time to think about what that means. @NixFred: And today, somebody can literally tweet at 8:00 AM, "I think I'm going to ship, uh, a CRM system tonight." And then they actually ship it by 9:30 AM. @NixFred: So, you know, the... the execution of ideas is so quick that you really can't see what's beyond the next corner because the next corner is 15 minutes away. @calledtocnstrct: Yeah. Yeah. It... it really is, um, you know, hyperspeed. @NixFred: It really is. @calledtocnstrct: So we've... we've got... @NixFred: All right. Let's get Lee in here, and let's have a chat with Lee. Lee is my boy. @NixFred: I've... I've been talking to him off and on on Zoom, and he is, uh, doing some amazing things with, um, Omarchy Different Minds. Lee, what's going on today, man? @NotJustShaking: Hey, everybody. Good to see everyone. Um, just a quick update from me. @NotJustShaking: I've got six points, so I'm going to rattle through them because we've got a lot of people in here. So, um, just want to cover a few things that I've worked on, finished, still going. @NixFred: All right. @NotJustShaking: Um, so the first one was the stuff that I was doing with, um, Omarchy and the Waveshare device. Part one of my article is complete, and that is available on my Substack. And if anyone wants to know where that is, you can just click in my... my bio, and it's in there. @NotJustShaking: So that's done. Part two is underway. @NotJustShaking: So that's all about, um, making it easier for people with disabilities, cognitive issues, to control the Omarchy desktop from, um, what is, in essence, a, um, an iPad type of device. So part one done. @NixFred: Great. @NotJustShaking: Part two underway. Um. @NixFred: Very cool. @NotJustShaking: I was, uh, lucky enough, or, um, yeah, that's... that's the word, to be invited by Basti. I think everybody knows Basti, uh, for, uh, uh, to record a podcast with him. I did that yesterday. @NotJustShaking: I was nervous as hell for, you know, the obvious reasons. Ended up really enjoying it. @NotJustShaking: We spoke for an hour. That was really cool. @NotJustShaking: So that's going to come out in two weeks, where I was able to let him know, um, you know, my journey in terms of, um, switching over to Omarchy. @NixFred: Sure. @NotJustShaking: Um, working on different minds with you, Fred, and... and, uh, and a ton more. Um, I'm working on the, uh, the what I call the Wired Differently Volt OS, which is going to be built into Omarchy for different minds. And that's basically an obsidian vault that will, via, um, a number of questions given to you by whichever AI you want to use, um, Claude or Codex, will build the vault, um, for you, um, to take away the pain, uh, the frustration, um, away from doing that yourself. @NotJustShaking: Because it can be overwhelming, especially for people with cognitive issues. So I am testing that. @NotJustShaking: I'm testing that on my Mac that I put Omarchy on very recently. Uh, it's an old iMac. @NotJustShaking: Um, I, um, I'm going to be installing Omarchy on my Chromebook that I thought I didn't have, and I have an old ThinkPad from when I first started work in the US, like, 15 years ago. I'm going to be putting Omarchy on those two devices, so then I will have four devices with Omarchy on and use them for something or other. @NotJustShaking: Not really sure. And then in terms of GrokBox, I gave that access to my vault, and that's working out really well, step by step. @NotJustShaking: Uh, the my vault, my obsidian vault is my life. So I don't want to give it, you know, access to do everything, but the way in which that is able to interact with it is great. @NotJustShaking: And... and using Markdown files, I'm able to get Grok and DOTS within, um, ChatGPT to talk to each other. So they... so whilst there is no way of doing that, you know, um, through some kind of connection, they just read Markdown files, each of them, so they each know what each of them is working on, so they don't, um, double up the work. @NotJustShaking: And then they can share with me if they have, uh, uh, any... any problems. Um, and I also set up DOTS to text me when anyone mentions me in, uh, in the next post, because I'm terrible at, uh, at... at kind of identifying when someone has emailed me or sent me a message. @NotJustShaking: So, um, uh, it also does that. It's also, um, I also taught how to fill out my, uh, um, you know, the... the... the your pre-check-in for your doctors as well. @NixFred: Yeah. @NotJustShaking: So that was quite cute. But that's me. That's what I've done this week. @NixFred: All right, man. Well, I appreciate you, and thanks for joining us. Would everybody please do... do me a favor personally, and... and follow Lee, and if you find it in your heart, to, uh, subscribe to his Substack, give him a little bit more voice. @NixFred: And if you really find it in your heart, sign up as a subscriber. And Lee, you're a champ. @NixFred: We love you, and, uh, hope to hear from you this week. And, uh, want to Zoom with you again this week sometime. @NixFred: I was the problem this week. Sorry about that. @NotJustShaking: No problem. @NixFred: All right. Who we got next? @calledtocnstrct: Well, uh, the next up just dropped off. I'm not sure if that was a connection, uh, issue or not. So I'm shuffling things around a little bit. @calledtocnstrct: If, uh, uh, Coronara, if you want to join back as a speaker, uh, you can jump right up and speak. I'll give it a few seconds, and then we will move to the next. @NixFred: All right. Here we got. Let's see. @NixFred: Are we having the. @calledtocnstrct: All right. @NixFred: Are we having the approved speaker problems? @calledtocnstrct: I... no, actually, they... they were able to join, but then, uh, it must have been a connection issue and dropped off. @NixFred: All right. @calledtocnstrct: So. @NixFred: Well, do you want to... why don't you pick one that you'd like to talk to? I'll take DevSec. @calledtocnstrct: Yeah. @NixFred: Lee, you go ne... you go next. @calledtocnstrct: Yeah. So, Zack, um, why don't we... why don't we, uh, have a little chat? I, um, I don't think that I was following you before, which is actually an excellent, um, opportunity for me to say, everybody in the room, look around, find people that you're not currently following, and give them a follow. @calledtocnstrct: Because, uh, this is a community, and we're building... building things together, and we're sharing ideas. Uh, so, Zack, um, you're on stage. @calledtocnstrct: Hopefully, you're able to hear, and everything's connected okay. Uh, what you got going on? @calledtocnstrct: What you building? @ZryMiller: Uh, yeah. So I have been working, I don't know, probably on the past two months on my own, um, agent development environment. And so what Nix was talking about, or Fred, sorry, um. @NixFred: No, it's all good, brother. @ZryMiller: Yeah. What you were talking about, uh, with using GrokBot to essentially interact with Herder, I've been working on a feature in my ADE call. It's called SODO. @ZryMiller: Um, and it's... it's a feature called Watcher. So essentially, um, it kind of does what you mentioned. @ZryMiller: It hooks up to whatever provider subscriptions you have, um, Claude, Codex, Muse, you know, all the major ones, basically. And then you can assign a certain model that watches all of your threads. @ZryMiller: And it... I don't know if you guys have had this problem where, um, you'll have a model working on a thread. It'll encounter a question or an issue. @ZryMiller: Um, it'll have that question kind of buried in its reasoning summary, and then that thread just kind of sits idle for hours without working. Um, so that... that was an issue I was running into a lot. @ZryMiller: So that's kind of why I built Watcher. Essentially keep threads moving. @ZryMiller: Um, so now it kind of just brings permissions and questions to me, and then it manages, um, everything else. Um, and so built an iOS app for it, uh, and finally have it kind of fully functional on all three, uh, major operating systems. @ZryMiller: So it's available on Windows, uh, macOS, and I've optimized it for Omarchy. Um, but yeah, that's. @NixFred: That's all? @ZryMiller: That's kind of what it is. It has dictation built in. Um, and then. @calledtocnstrct: Well, one of the... one of the questions that... that comes to mind, something I've been kind of struggling with, is, you know, are you... are you having this be something that responds to you with that context? Or do you actually have, like, a... a loop where it's... it's going and... and checking every little bit and, and. @ZryMiller: Yeah. So it goes... it goes through any... any thread that you assign it to watch. So you can either manage the thread yourself, or you can assign it to Watcher. @ZryMiller: And so any thread you assign it to watch, it basically, um, it ha... it SODO is acting as a M... MCP server, so it has tools within SODO that it can use. Um, so it can, uh, it sends prompts to the, um, threads. @ZryMiller: It... the biggest thing I've been using it for lately is to organize, um, how I... I've been merging a lot of PRs lately, and CI has been a huge bottleneck for me. Um, I don't... I'm sure others are running into that issue. @ZryMiller: And so I have it. @NixFred: Yeah. @ZryMiller: I was noticing that when I was trying to manage a bunch of threads, I would run into PRs getting merged, and then I constantly had agents stepping on each other because they weren't coordinating between each other. So now Watcher basically just sits there and queues everything for CI, um, based on who's... which thread is in line to merge their PR. So that's been a huge, uh, time saver for me. @ZryMiller: It's... it's... it... it handles all the coordination between threads, um, and it has full control. So really, it just... it brings questions to me that only need my attention, um, or a permissions thing where that could be considered, like, a dangerous, uh, you know, like, remove my entire C drive or something. @NixFred: Yeah. @calledtocnstrct: Um. @NixFred: That makes sense. Well, I... I, you know, kind of in... in that same, uh, thought, uh, one of the things that... that I've been concerned with, and I... and... and my question, my quick question, uh, to you is, you know, are you more concerned about freeing yourself up from, you know, kind of having to be a... a slave to the, you know, screen, or, you know, constantly involving yourself in the... in the minor details? Or are you looking at ways to optimize, uh, your token usage and @NixFred: ... and trying to get out of the, uh, you know, where things are just constantly thrashing? Or is it a combination of both? @ZryMiller: It's a combination of both. I've actually found with Watcher, I get into more of a flow state because it will, you know, I've... if I've handed it, like, say, 10 or so threads that are running in parallel, it is constantly working with those threads. And I can just sit above that and just work with one agent, which has been kind of freeing for me to not have to try to memorize where all of these threads are at. @ZryMiller: And it just gives me questions that I can focus on rather than getting into this super nitty-gritty. I just let the agents handle that. @NixFred: So, so, Zack, on... on that, uh, sorry, sorry, uh, on that, how do you... I've... I've played around with that, and I get concerned that I've got one agent that I'm talking to as the governor of the rest, for lack of a better term. And. @ZryMiller: Yeah. @NixFred: I kind of get... I get concerned that... that... that one agent does, like, kind of loses the, you know, loses the topic and kind of. @ZryMiller: So. @NixFred: What does it do? @ZryMiller: Yeah. So what I have it do is it keeps a notepad outside a compaction. So I've been messing around with when is the optimal time to compact the context, right? @ZryMiller: Because you lose a lot of the details. And so essentially, the way I get around that is I have it keep a notepad of, um, important details, like the last thing it sent to a thread, or... or... or just a quick note of where a... a certain thread is at. @ZryMiller: And so even if it compacts, it's... it... it's forced to reread that notebook on compaction or while it's working, um, to... to make sure it... it keeps up to date with what's going on. It also has timers built in, so it doesn't just forget about a thread. @ZryMiller: So if it hasn't heard from an idle thread in over 20 minutes, it will go check in on it. Um. @NixFred: Mm-hmm. @ZryMiller: And then the other thing I've been working on is allowing it to orchestrate across machines. So in SODO, you can connect remote machines through Tailscale. And then if it notices your machine is loading up on CPU usage, it can hand... it can hand off a thread to... or this is the idea... it can hand a thread off or multiple sub-agents to another machine. @ZryMiller: Or if it notices a test needs to be done on Linux and it's working on Mac or on Windows, it will hand sub-agents... it will tell the parent to orchestrate sub-agents ch... children on another machine. So that... that's kind of what I've been getting into, is having the... the... this Watcher feature basically become the master or manager orchestrator, and then parents are the main orchestrating models that orchestrate other models. @ZryMiller: So it becomes this big tree. @NixFred: Do you think this is something we're fixing that, yet again, is going to be fixed by the frontiers later? Because I... I... I know that a lot of you, like me, have worked on fixing problems that are, you know, with even really early on, like memory and, you know, the different features of Claude code back in the day, and we'd fix it, and then three weeks later, you know, uh, Anthropic comes out with the... that feature to fix that whole problem. Do you think this whole management @NixFred: thing is going to become a... a non-issue? And how... how long out do you think that'll be? @ZryMiller: Um, I have no idea. I mean, I... I... I have seen, like, inklings of, you know, Cursor trying to do this with projects, and, um, Claude code trying to do this with their... but the thing that I find is that I don't want to work on a cloud someone else's cloud computer. And same thing with GrokBot. @ZryMiller: Um, I'd rather work on my own machines and kind of, uh, be able to have my agents work in those. I don't want to have, you know, an outside connector that then has to remote into my machine that then has to run a command. @ZryMiller: I want it all connected within whatever machine I'm working on. And so I don't know how they really fix that problem, but yeah, I... I am sure that, uh, overall orchestrator agents are coming. @ZryMiller: Um, it's just when. Maybe... maybe a month, maybe six months. @ZryMiller: I have no idea. @calledtocnstrct: Yeah. That's great. Um, you know, I, uh, I did shift just a... a second, um, to... to look at the, um, the queue. @calledtocnstrct: So I apologize for not having a... an intelligent, uh, response to that. But, um, I... I think this is, like, you know, probably in... at least in software development, um, and... and, of course, branching out into hardware and things like that with MCP connecting to everything, 3D printers and... and, um, you know, board layout. @calledtocnstrct: But, uh, you know, this is... this is kind of the... the challenge right now. And I... I think, um, Fred, your question is... is perfect, right? @calledtocnstrct: Like, wh... what's the horizon look like for that? So, um. @NixFred: Yeah. And it gets... it's just... it's wrapped in another, you know, where's the... what's the future? And then you can break it down into the little problems that we have. @NixFred: And you... you know, the... we don't know the whole future, and then we see a specific problem. Like, you know, I think it's amazing that Zack is building an orchestrator of orchestrators, maybe? @NixFred: Um. @ZryMiller: It's a manager orchestrator. It's a manager, is how I see it. It just manages everything, so. @NixFred: Right. And at some point, you're going to have a watch that manages that, and then we'll have. @ZryMiller: Yeah. @NixFred: Everything that manages that. So where does it start? Where does it stop? @ZryMiller: Yeah. But yeah, if anyone's interested, it's fully open source. Um, it... the... the link to download it is on my bio. @ZryMiller: It's on GitHub. Um, so that's... that's pretty much... that's it. @ZryMiller: That's what the main app is built around, is Watcher, so. @NixFred: Awesome, bro. @ZryMiller: Thanks. @NixFred: Thank you, brother. @calledtocnstrct: All right. Well, next up, we do have, uh, DevSec. We want to hear all the things you're working on and what is your perspective on this, you know, fog of war. @calledtocnstrct: Like, are we able to actually see what's coming up? @devsec_ai: Yeah. So, um, I was... hey, guys. How are... hope everybody's having a great Sunday. @devsec_ai: I apologize. I'm in a car, so if I have a background noise. @NixFred: Hey, yeah, just. @devsec_ai: Apologies for that, but, um. @NixFred: Just mute... mute when you're not talking, okay? @devsec_ai: Yeah. Yeah, for sure. So... so I think you guys brought up a good point. @devsec_ai: Where do... where do you go from here? There's... I actually... I actually think you are in the for... um, early stages of things. @devsec_ai: So there is a lot of, you know, there is, you know, a lot of headway, right? And we can go historically, and we can take a look at where we were in the early '90s with the internet, and then where we were with the Web 2.0, and then the Web 3.0, the blockchain, and where we are now. @devsec_ai: And this is basically resetting all that foundation. And basically, um, it's a new stack that you are building on top of. @devsec_ai: Um, so having said that, there is a lot to go down in the, um, in... in... there is a lot to build. Um, and I think that there is a lot of tooling that has to be done, a lot of tooling that has to be improved, um, a lot of security work that has to get done. @devsec_ai: And most importantly, new interfaces and user... user experiences have to come up, right? And... and, you know, you guys are... we're all lucky in this... in this journey because we see this with Omarchy right now, because a lot of us are building user interfaces. @devsec_ai: A lot of us are building underlying platforms. A lot of us are building, you know, orchestration layers, etc., etc. @devsec_ai: And we see... we see that where this is going, right? And we're just... it's just getting started, guys. @devsec_ai: Um, but is... is everything going to be... you know, there are a lot of things that will get probably integrated by Frontier Labs eventually. But like I said in, you know, my previous, um, X posts is... is that it shouldn't discourage you. @devsec_ai: Uh, it should enable you. And that's because primarily... it is primarily because, you know, anything that gets into these mod... you know, or into these, you know, Frontier Labs, uh, harnesses, etc., those are defaults. @devsec_ai: The defaults will always need customization for... for different workflows. And that's where you come in. @devsec_ai: That's where all of us come in. So I don't think that we should take a look at any of this stuff as, oh, one day we're going to be swallowed into this, you know, uh, black hole and there's no way out. @devsec_ai: It's just... it's not... it's not true. I think we... I think if it... if it... one thing that it should do is it should empower you to build more. @devsec_ai: So I think we're at a very early stages of foundation. What is going to be a very... a little bit of a, uh, uh, uh, slowdown, it's not going to be as fast as things start to build. @devsec_ai: Security is going to be the key. So what's going to have is going to be... there's going to be a lot of wall guarding. @devsec_ai: The terms of services is a problem because what happens is... is that we see that with Rhea right now, right? Reverse, um, engineer anything. @devsec_ai: Um, you know, Claude code is starting to, you know, ban people for using Rhea. @NixFred: Right. @devsec_ai: Um, so... so you're going to see this. Uh, we saw this in early e-commerce days of eBay starting to, you know, ban people for stupid reasons when they were selling stuff that they didn't agree to. So yes, you are going to get this fr... uh, you are going to get these, uh, frictions. @devsec_ai: But I think at the end of the day, when it comes to vision, um, of where we're going, I think, you know, there will be some slowdown, but still, it's going to be a pretty accelerated pace. @NixFred: That's amazing, bro. So, uh, Mean, you've talked a couple times. I know you well, Martin. @NixFred: You've got a really solid background. You know what you're talking about. @NixFred: You came out of McCaffrey. I did see a post from you about, uh, omarchystore.com. @NixFred: How did you find out it was a scam, and what do you know about it? Help us... help us avoid a problem. @devsec_ai: So, so I didn't know, right? I... I was... it was news to me. So what happened was I... I've got GrokBot news and all of... all of the instinct, uh, instinct AI, everything running, um, and all the time. @devsec_ai: So Muse was the first one to message me and saying, "Hey, FYI, just, you know, there is a security... I mean, there is a potential, you know, scam going on here. You need to watch out." @devsec_ai: And I put... I... I precisely posted the screenshot. Um, and that's the. @NixFred: And I took a look at... I took a look at it based on your post. And so they have shut down the store, and they said, "We heard you." And they admit... I... I can't say if they're a scammer or not. @NixFred: I... I'm going to give them grace, just like we should all give everyone grace. But what they say they're working on is they're removing anything running with elevated position, uh, permissions. @NixFred: And I know that they had some pretty big problems. They're building installs so that you always see it and approve it yourself. @NixFred: And they... they say that they're reviewing every listing. So we are talking about them. @NixFred: Let's give them grace. It might be legit. @NixFred: Let's don't... let's don't assume anything. Um. @devsec_ai: So. @NixFred: I hope... I hope that they are amazing. I hope that it's something that's going to be great. I want to see everyone succeed, and I'm not going to count anybody out until they stab me with that, right? @NixFred: So, okay. @devsec_ai: So from my perspective. @NixFred: One last question. One last question for you, Martin. I can't let you go without you talking about, uh, Shield. @NixFred: Tell us about the NVIDIA Shield TV, man. @devsec_ai: Yeah. So, so, so the... so the... so, so we... we successfully broke NVIDIA Shield, uh, 2017, uh, from the, uh, uh, Android and NVIDIA wall garden, and we put, uh, Omarchy on it, uh, which... which is based on an ARM Tegra X1 processor. Um, it was 48 hours of doing, uh, of tinkering, and... and it... it was... it was... but when I say 48 hours, I mean, you know, every day, like, being 16 to 18-hour days. @devsec_ai: Um, now you can say agents doing the majority of the work. Uh, yes and no, because there's a lot of manual work that has to go, unplugging in, plugging in, something not working. @devsec_ai: Uh, there's a physical hardware there. So, um, so we did that, uh, our, you know, the Omarchy installs. @devsec_ai: We had to write some drivers, uh, to make sure that the, uh, um, sound and, you know, heat... um, not just the sound, but the... the GPU acceleration and also, um, the heat man... uh, the temperature management and everything else is working properly. We did that. @devsec_ai: Um, and, uh, it's running. Uh, the... it's, um, it's great. @devsec_ai: Um, so we were like, "Okay, so what, you know, one done. What's next?" @devsec_ai: So I basically took out a bunch of old dusted-off tech, and we basically went, uh, the next one is a Surface Book, uh, uh, Surface Pro 4 running on an Intel processor. Um, and on that guy, the problem with that guy is... is that, yes, you can, you know, easily load Omarchy because it's x86. @devsec_ai: But the challenge that you have there is... is that the, um, uh, the touchscreen and the, um, all of the, you know, you know, anything that was built into the firmware for drivers for touchscreen and everything else, uh, multi-touch, nothing... nothing was working. So we got it... so we got it completely working now. @devsec_ai: Um, in fact, you might see a demo later on today. And I built a complete desktop mode and a tablet mode into it. @devsec_ai: And DHH was, uh, basically commenting on it because he's... he's... he's eager to see it. Um, so we put the tablet mode on. @devsec_ai: Uh, the tablet, you know, basically, you un-dock it. It becomes a tablet mode. @devsec_ai: You dock it. It becomes a laptop. @devsec_ai: Um, it comes with... and... and all of the, you know, all of the gestures, everything, you know, gets converted into a tablet. So now you have this device that can be a media consumption and por... you know, portable device that you can take anywhere with you, un-docked. @devsec_ai: But when you pro... just like, you know, Samsung, uh, decks, when you bring it back and you dock it back in, it turns into a full desktop. @NixFred: That's amazing, bro. @devsec_ai: So keep up with the news for now. @NixFred: Yeah. @devsec_ai: For sure. @NixFred: All right. Thank you for... thank you for the chat, and thanks for showing up. @devsec_ai: Yeah, I appreciate it. Thank you. @NixFred: And, uh, we'll chat soon, bro. And, uh. @devsec_ai: Yeah, for sure. @NixFred: I have to give a letter right now. I know Heath. I've known him for 20 years. @NixFred: I know what he works on. I appreciate you joining, Heath. @NixFred: There's... and I'm going to just let you just... just talk, man. Everything you say, just start talking and I'll shut up. @MuchmoreIT: Uh, hopefully, hopefully you can hear me. @NixFred: Oh, we hear you great. Maybe pull away from the mic a little bit. @MuchmoreIT: Yep. Sorry. Um, so, uh, Fred, you... you and I definitely have to chat, uh, again, um, because you were talking about, uh, ideas. @MuchmoreIT: And unfortunately, I have too many ideas, and I don't have the time. Um, so if anybody that wants to reach out to me. @NixFred: Just pull me up, man. Just back off... back off that mic a little bit. @MuchmoreIT: Uh, believe it or not, uh, that... that is Omarchy Linux doing a fantastic job on the... on the microphone on my, uh, Dell laptop, so. @NixFred: There you go. So let me tell everybody a little bit about Heath. He works on the biggest systems that you know about, and he can't say what it is. @NixFred: He's not trying to be cool. He really does. @NixFred: Um, you were... you were also what, a F22 communication? @MuchmoreIT: 117. 117. F11, Stealth Fighter. @NixFred: Okay. So I'm... Heath does not... does not brag on himself, so I'll do it for him. He knows what he's talking about. @NixFred: Heath, what's the coolest thing you saw this week in the... in the world of, like, really, really, really big systems? And if you can tease us a little bit, anything you can tease us with, we want it. @MuchmoreIT: Uh, I mean, you know, I think the fun thing about where this whole world is going, particularly in this community, because I just want to say thank you. This community, Nick, you... you and my brother, um, you know, the way that this whole thing is... is evolving is just, you know, music to my ears. Because I've been a Unix/Linux guy for the longest, longest time, and there... there are things that, uh, I've done on Unix and Linux that I'll never be able to talk about. @MuchmoreIT: Um, you know, but, uh, for those who never knew, this... the big famous Stealth Fighter that I used to be on, we used to do our mission planning on crame supercomputers. Um, and so that's, you know, one of the ways that I got started on high-performance computing. @MuchmoreIT: It was a long, long time ago. But I think one of the things that's really evolving, that's kind of getting crazy, um, is you guys all know this from the quantitization perspective, is the... the level of tuning that's getting bigger and bigger models. @MuchmoreIT: Because while Fred says, you know, I don't use... say this to flaunt it, but it's interesting. I work on massive models, and it's not me. @MuchmoreIT: I'm not that smart. Um, I... I build systems for people that use the models. @MuchmoreIT: Um, to... to kind of put it in context, I'm working on one right now. It's a 2.8 trillion parameter model with 105 billion active, and it takes 72 GPUs just to run that one instance. @NixFred: Can I run it on my 5070? @MuchmoreIT: Uh, once we get it quantitized, maybe. Um, so. @NixFred: What's the... what did you do this week for it? @MuchmoreIT: Uh, so... so basically, what... what people, you know, uh, really have to understand, and if you saw any of my posts about, like, the AMD stuff, you'll know I'm an AMD fanatic because I used to work there, is that one of the things that matters more than anything is the... the how much memory your GPU actually has, because that's that model sizing, right? And, you know, people will be like, "Oh, I'm going to go get the new latest AMD, you know, 192 gig model." Well, you know, @MuchmoreIT: if you read my post, you'll be like, "Yeah, it's not worth that extra money because we're getting so much better efficiency, the work you guys are doing, the work the Frontier guys are doing, and it's all starting to get squished down so that if you can fit these models in, you know, in, you know, even a couple generations old GPU, you're way better off than... than we were." So the only thing I'm saying is I'm encouraging you to go out and download LM Studio if you haven't @MuchmoreIT: had... if you don't have it. Uh, link that in with, um, Llama, you know, really just start to push those models. Because believe it or not, we're... the software is getting more efficient in how the models are being... being utilized. @MuchmoreIT: And some of the work I'm doing, uh, you know, I say I, I'm building the system. I don't do a lot of the AI myself, but it... it's getting pushed down, uh, to a place that is an amazing spot for all of you to go build those things that you're building. @MuchmoreIT: And like I told Fred, anybody that wants to reach out to me, I'll give you ideas because I don't have time to build all of what goes on. But, uh, I've worked with, um, some of you on a couple of security things to start up. @MuchmoreIT: Uh, I... I have some... I have an engine that I may or may not be allowed to release to the world. I'm waiting for legal to clear me on it. @MuchmoreIT: And then I will also be, um, uh, I didn't catch who was talking about the... the, um, manager of managers. Um, so we have something like that that we've been working on for a while in the big labs, and... and I'm trying to figure out how to make that happen on the smaller world. @MuchmoreIT: Something like Omarchy runs this, and it can... it can make a call out to Azure, AWS, GCP, Oracle, or it can call your local limited server or your GB10 if you're lucky enough to have one, and... and just be able to coordinate it all. So reach out to me because I doubt I'll have the chance to reach out to you, and then I will gladly throw ideas at people like, "Here, here's an idea. @MuchmoreIT: Go build it for me." Because I knew this call. @MuchmoreIT: So I just... this is a thank you to everybody on this call. You guys are amazing. @MuchmoreIT: I love the work you're doing. Uh, I steal a lot of your ideas every day for what I do for the government. @MuchmoreIT: You may not like that. @NixFred: Thank you, Heath. And, man, we really appreciate you joining every week and sharing what you can. Uh, again, Heath is a very humble guy. @NixFred: He is in the know, and he's seeing stuff that is not even released yet. And, uh, we were happy to have him here. @NixFred: So, Heath, thanks for joining, brother. @MuchmoreIT: What I got hope is... is I'm... we're the only company and, uh, on the planet who's authorized to install Google TPUs on your premises. So... so if you think about Google TPUs that you can get in the GCP, we literally have, uh, an entire GC... uh, GCP rack in our... in our labs. Uh, and we install them in the government all the time. @MuchmoreIT: So that's my only brag, man. That's it. @MuchmoreIT: But I'm... I'm not the guy that knows that stuff, so. @NixFred: I got a... I got a best buy credit card. @MuchmoreIT: Yeah, that'll probably... probably buy you a couple minutes on the TPU. Yep. @NixFred: Hey, man, you're welcome here every time. I appreciate you. Love you too, Brian. @MuchmoreIT: Uh, thanks, everybody. Again, like, reach out to me, and, like, I'll probably throw some ideas at everybody. And, Fred, I'll... I'll grab some time on your calendar, I think. @MuchmoreIT: So thanks. @NixFred: Yeah. I want to talk to you Monday. I got... I actually got something I need to talk to you about. @NixFred: I'll call you. @MuchmoreIT: Sounds good. @NixFred: Thank you, brother. All right. Thank you, uh, Heath. @NixFred: What do we got next called? @calledtocnstrct: Yeah. Uh, compiling things. Uh, I know you've been busy. @calledtocnstrct: Uh, what do you got to share with us? What... and, and, you know, we're kind of talking about, like, this. @calledtocnstrct: How do you see things, uh, down the road? Do you have some clear vision, or are things getting, uh, cloud... you know, kind of cloudy? @calledtocnstrct: And, and, uh, what's been... what's been going on? @Compilethings: Um, yeah. The way I work is I... I stick to my system, and I try to let all the noise settle around me and not pay attention to how things are changing because what works for me works for me. Um, I was very interested in what Zack said, though, about the orchestrator. @Compilethings: I run an orchestrator of orchestrators in Claude Code, and I'm, um, I'm making the GitHub now for it and releasing it. It's not anything the same as his, but maybe he can look at it and pick it apart and tell me what I'm doing wrong, or maybe he can take something from it for his or because I... I literally can run sessions for weeks. @Compilethings: I was in Poland. I was in Poland for a week. @Compilethings: I set up remote desktop on my telephone. I checked in two times a day. @Compilethings: They're not stopping. They don't... they don't stop. @Compilethings: I have it. But I'm... I'm going to post it. @Compilethings: I'm very bad at explaining things, but I'm going to... I'm writing an article up on it, and I'm going to put it on the GitHub, and it's going to be a one-click, uh, one-click test if anybody wants to test it. It's being tested now in the cloud by Claude until he breaks everything and finds... makes sure everything's right. @Compilethings: Um, so I wanted to... to reach out and talk to... to Zack if he was interested in that. And, uh, and, Heath, I run all AMD hardware, um, R9700s, a little bit of local inference, playing with, uh, Strata, so much larger models crammed into smaller spaces, but still maintaining quality. @NixFred: Nice. That's awesome. @Compilethings: My wife loves it. I haven't made it work for my work, um, but she loves it for legal work and stuff that she wants to keep off... off the internet. Um, other... I'm working with Omarchy, uh, just on the T480 right now. @Compilethings: I'm trying to get deeper into it, but I have to convert my old Windows machine. And it's just... it's... it's a lot. @Compilethings: But I'm, uh, I'm... I'm happy to... to be in the group and... and to listen and... and share what I'm doing. And I'll share my whole workflow in the next, I would say, two days. @Compilethings: It'll be out, and I'll put an article out on it. And every... I don't, uh, I prefer criticism, so you're not going to hurt my feelings. @Compilethings: You can just... @calledtocnstrct: How can you get better if you don't know what, uh, where you can improve, right? @Compilethings: Yeah. You can cut straight to the core, and I'm going to respect you for it. So, uh, thank you. @calledtocnstrct: That's awesome. And, and I'll... I'll tell you, um, you know, you're... you're embracing the spirit of open source right there. Um, you know, it's not, uh, you know, my... I'm a competitor, or, you know, they're a competitor. @calledtocnstrct: It's how can we share ideas? How can we bring our concepts together? @calledtocnstrct: And I love that, um, you've got some... @Compilethings: I... I play on both sides of the field, open and closed. I... um, yeah. @Compilethings: Because I still think there are some... some things worth holding back. @calledtocnstrct: Maybe... maybe that'll be a topic for, uh, for one of these, uh, sessions, uh, you know, open and... open and closed, and you know what's your mindset. But, uh, you know, I really appreciate, you know, you... you coming up and saying, "Hey, you know, I've got something that's kind of similar, but maybe we've got, you know, some unique ideas between these different projects," and, and, uh, you know, wanting to bring things together. @Compilethings: They're... they're the same, but his sounds much more clean. Mine is... mine literally just runs off of my .md files with Claude, and he can... I can spawn him seven sessions. Session one is the orchestrator of the orchestrators. @Compilethings: Every other session is an orchestrator with sub-agents. Session one's passing out all the work. @Compilethings: He holds all the context. I use a... a skill called compact skill. @Compilethings: I use a skill called startup skill. I use a skill called shutdown skill. @Compilethings: And those three skills maintain main thread context by the way they're playing. @calledtocnstrct: Yeah. Well, I'm... I'm super excited to, uh, to see, you know, what you put out and to see your article. Uh, I... you know, it's so hard to... to find, uh, high-quality content in this sea of information. @calledtocnstrct: And so that's why I'm so excited to have connections with all the people in this, uh, group. And... and it keeps expanding, of course, but, um, you know, being able to put something together and put it to... put together like an article, like you said, and... and be able to... to share that out with the community, um, really helps. @Compilethings: Well, I mean, I'm not doing it. I... I... I asked Claude to do it. I'll be honest about that. @Compilethings: He's... he's working. He's working hard on it. @calledtocnstrct: You're... you're the brains behind the curtain. Okay. So we'll... we'll... we'll look at it that way. @calledtocnstrct: But, uh, I really appreciate you coming up and... and... and sharing about this and... and letting people know what's coming. And so if... if they're, you know, looking to... to get into something like that. @Compilethings: I... I think none of us know what is coming. I think this is such a disruptive technology that we can't even imagine what will happen because tomorrow can be different than when we went to bed. @calledtocnstrct: Absolutely. Yeah. @Compilethings: Things are moving that fast. I... I see a world with open source everything. @calledtocnstrct: I... I... I... I've been in software for decades, and, you know, I'm thinking about the same thing. Uh, absolutely. It's... it's going to be really, uh, fast. @Compilethings: I... I see open source video games as good as the main publishers. I see it. Yeah. @Compilethings: It's going to happen. It's going to happen. @calledtocnstrct: Yeah. Yeah. @Compilethings: We can't stop. @calledtocnstrct: That's really awesome. @Compilethings: We can adapt like humans do. That's all we can do. @calledtocnstrct: Yeah. Well, I really appreciate you coming up and sharing. Um, we've got. @Compilethings: Yeah, thanks for that. @calledtocnstrct: Uh, Porsche coming up and talking about putting together information and presenting it to people. You've got, uh, you know, some experience with this, and I'm... I'm kind of curious to hear your... your viewpoint on this. Uh, like, you know, are you getting a clear vision of what's coming up, or, you know, what... how do you plan your, um, what... what you're doing next? @letsbuildanyway: Oh, my goodness. Thank you so much for those questions. Um, I've been thinking a lot about open source, and I talk to a lot of people who are not developers. @letsbuildanyway: And to directly answer, where do we go from here, I want to know what someone who doesn't like to tinker, what... which technologies in terms of Grokbot and Hermes that they're going to actually take away, and which technologies is just something that open source developers are going to get together and just talk about. Um, I make the assumption when I create content that people are lazy, that people value convenience, and that if someone had an hour, an extra hour, it's no question that they would use it @letsbuildanyway: for Netflix. And that's what I'm trying to piece out. Well, which part of these conversations that we're having will actually be implemented to the masses, and which one is just a great hobby? @letsbuildanyway: Um, so that's what I think about a lot. I think the biggest technology is the UX and how we are going to change workflows. @letsbuildanyway: Because asking people, "Hey, you have a whole department," like the corporate... the corporation, I think, was started by Henry Ford, if I'm not mistaken. And I think this is one of the biggest challenges of corporations and how businesses are organized. @letsbuildanyway: And I don't think folks are going to look at a Grokbot or what the heck I'm doing with Hermes and then naturally say that, um, middle management doesn't make sense, or we shouldn't have this kind of promotion. And so that's on a broad sense of what I think about. @letsbuildanyway: I... my content is more of a conversation. So it's really interest... it's really interesting. @letsbuildanyway: Like, people say, "Hey, this resonates with me," or, "You got everything wrong." And I was ex... that's what I was going for, especially for my local models, um, my latest video. @letsbuildanyway: Because I... I hear people talk about privacy a lot. And for me, I just took a problem, and I just tried to... and I created a solution. @letsbuildanyway: There are so many things that I don't know about these different models. There are so many things I don't know about a properly. @NixFred: Well, Porscha, hold on. Let's talk about the things you do know. What... what are you doing with the local models? @NixFred: Because I... you know, I think everybody knows that we want to get to the local. We want to get away from, you know, the open source community. @NixFred: Um, we embrace the frontier because it's helping us do what we want to do. But at the same time, you know, the frontiers might be anti-somewhat open source. @NixFred: I don't want to... maybe that's heresy to say. Um, but. @letsbuildanyway: No, but I think they know better than open. @NixFred: Yeah. Maybe that's it. So what... what's your thoughts on that? @NixFred: Where does it go? @letsbuildanyway: Oh, um, in terms of the frontier models not being supportive of open source? @NixFred: Yes. @letsbuildanyway: I... I thought you didn't like political questions. @NixFred: I don't think that's politics. I think that's... I think that's straight down the line of economics and ne... needs of people. And. @letsbuildanyway: I think we underestimate how many people want a nanny when it comes to. @NixFred: Right. @letsbuildanyway: Using computers. I mean, that's why I'm so talkative. @NixFred: Oh, now you're getting... now you're getting political on me, Porscha. @letsbuildanyway: But I'm not even talk... I mean, you started it, but I don't think many of us really appreciate how many folks actually want someone to tell them what to do and what not to do. Like, the average person that I've spoken to, they feel like freedom is a threat. They feel like they must have something above them telling them what to do. @letsbuildanyway: And so when we talk about the importance of open source, I mean, we're really not talking to the language of, I think, a lot of everyday worker drones. @NixFred: Right. @letsbuildanyway: Oh, God. That was really... that was... that had a lot of opinions in that statement. So that's what I think about a lot. @letsbuildanyway: And then that's... and that's really the reasons why I create this kind of content. Like I said before, I really loved working for Hermes and creating a local model, downloading it, seeing that my hardware kind of sucks. @letsbuildanyway: And, uh, so that's where I'm at. I feel like I am blabbering now, so I'll stop there. @NixFred: Yep. Porscha, you are always welcome here. You're one of the teammates. @NixFred: We love you, and I look forward to talking to you every single week. @letsbuildanyway: Thank you. @calledtocnstrct: Yeah. And that's... that's, um, you know, that's a really interesting insight. Um, we should come back to that, uh, concept of, you know, somebody coming up with ideas on their own versus, you know, kind of like having things handed down. @calledtocnstrct: There was actually some really, uh, interesting studies, uh, done around that. So let's, uh, let's table that for a discussion, uh, on another call. @calledtocnstrct: But, um, I... I'm interested to hear your thoughts on that when we get around to it. Uh, thank you so much for that. @calledtocnstrct: We've got Daniel coming up. And again, I wasn't following Daniel, uh, when we started this call. @calledtocnstrct: So I am really excited to. @NixFred: Shame on you. @calledtocnstrct: Exactly. Right. Right. @calledtocnstrct: I... like, I've had my head in the sand. But, uh, tell us a little bit about yourself, and what are you working on? @calledtocnstrct: And what's your... like, how are you seeing into the future with... with everything being, uh, changing so fast and... and being kind of cloudy? @calledtocnstrct: Go ahead and unmute yourself if you, uh, haven't done so already. @NixFred: You might want to check your mic, Daniel. You are unmuted. You just need to check that mic, brother. @NixFred: All right. Well, let's let him work on that. @NixFred: You want to take the next one? @dsegan: Can you hear me now? @NixFred: We hear you, brother. @letsbuildanyway: Yeah. We can hear you. @NixFred: We're still in time. @dsegan: Great. Sorry about that. Hey. @NixFred: No. @dsegan: Uh, thanks. Thanks for, uh, thanks for giving me the opportunity to speak. Um, so my name is Dan, um, and, uh, you know, my background is I... I kind of... I... I've worked in the tech industry for a long time, since the late '90s. @dsegan: Um, you know, I... I, uh, I got in back in the days of, like, Sun Solaris and HP-UX and all of those things, if you remember that. So, like, you know, old Slackware Linux when it first came out. @dsegan: And, um, I... I got into Omarchy, um, before the Quattro release. So, uh, you know, the... the... the predecessor to... to where we are now. @dsegan: It wasn't as AI-focused. I... I just kind of liked it because I wanted to... I... I had this little workshop in my basement. @dsegan: I... I wanted, like, a hacker, you know, workstation kind of thing, um, and set it up to kind of help me do things. I had a Commodore 64 down there that I was playing around with. @dsegan: And, uh, you know, I just really liked the way it looked and all that. And, um, and... and that... you know, that... that's what kind of drove me, uh, to... to using... using it in the first place. @dsegan: Um, but, like, the... you know, the way it's changed with the... the... the Quattro release, like with, you know, the AI-centric, agentic, uh, you know, um, you know, approach is... is... is really, you know, really appealing as well. And, you know, I... I... I've been really digging it. @calledtocnstrct: What... what doors has that opened for you? Um, you know, if you think about, um, from a builder's perspective, you know, did you... did you all of a sudden see, like, "Hey, now I can build differently"? And... and, you know, do you have some projects you're working on? @dsegan: Yeah. So I, um, you know, I was a developer back in the day, like a .NET developer and, you know, that... that type of thing. @dsegan: And, um, you know, just exploring AI in general, like with... with Grok and Grokbot and all that. Like, I started building a, uh, like a Lucasfilm-style video game about my... my friends have like a punk comedy type band that they... they do, and kind of building a game around that. @dsegan: Uh, and, uh, you know, just... just projects that I would have never thought of doing, despite being a developer, despite, you know, having some... some technical chops, um, you know, just kind of opened up the door, uh, for that. But, you know, in the... you know, on the... on the other side, on the... on the professional side, so my day job, I work for, uh, you know, one of these big hyperscalers that also sells an office suite. @dsegan: So if you could kind of guess who that is. Um, but just seeing kind of, you know, the way that AI is being adopted by customers in, you know, big corporate customers in... in... in the industry. @dsegan: It's... it's the Wild West right now. It is... it's AI is kind of magic, but it's also exposing to some of these... these, uh, um, customers and corporate, um, folks. @dsegan: Like, the... the software development aspect was never the hard part in getting stuff to work in that world. Um, you know, and it... and it... I think it... I think it's definitely exposing, uh, quite a bit of that. @dsegan: Um. @NixFred: That's awesome. Hey, Daniel, I got a question for you. So. @dsegan: Sure. @NixFred: You and I interact on X quite... maybe quite frequently, and. @dsegan: Yes. @NixFred: I saw that you handed Grokbot over, uh, an API key over to your Unify. @dsegan: Yes. @NixFred: And what... what came of that? What did you get fixed? @dsegan: Well, so I... I set... I, you know, kind of like I think what you were saying. I... I had set up a Unify environment, you know, a bunch of access points, and I had had some intermittent, um, signal issues in my basement, you know, when I'm walking around access point to access point. Nothing to where I wanted to, like, get in there and tear things apart and figure it out, but kind of an annoying issue nonetheless. @dsegan: So. @NixFred: Yeah. One of those things. @dsegan: So I. @NixFred: One of those things. It's like a pain in the ass, but. @dsegan: Yeah. @NixFred: Like, you don't. @dsegan: Yeah. Yeah. @NixFred: Man, I don't... I don't feel like rebooting my router for that. @dsegan: Right. Right. So I saw your post, and I said, "You know what? @dsegan: Hot damn, I'm just going to do that." So I sent it over to my Grokbot. @dsegan: It logged into the... the router that I had. @NixFred: Oh. @dsegan: It reconfigured everything. It found the problem with the radios. It... it identified a, uh, like a universal plug-and-play broadcast problem and a printer bro... like, tons of stuff that I would have never even had... had, you know, um, considered. @dsegan: And it cleaned up the re... like, I don't have any network retries anymore. Um, and the... the funny thing, I was... I was on my way, uh, the other day. @dsegan: I... I went to Micro Center to pick up, like, a... a NAS device. And I'm thinking about, "Well, when I get home, I'm going to have to, you know, back this up, put this over there." @dsegan: So I just started talking to the bot that had that key. And I said, you know, "Go SSH into this machine," and, you know, basically getting things ready, um, you know, to be... to be able to set this thing up. @dsegan: And that... that was kind of a magical, um, experience, especially I was, like, um, speaking to it over the Grokbot integration in my... my car. And it... it... it felt really Star Trek. @dsegan: So, uh, you know, it was... it was a... a really cool kind of technical, uh, experience. But. @NixFred: That's really cool. @dsegan: I just want to... I'll just wrap it up. And I wanted to... to say that I'm trying to get the Cleveland, Ohio area, um, event going. So I. @NixFred: Yeah. @dsegan: I did one last month. @NixFred: It's the speech word, right? Did you guys have your meeting last night? @dsegan: Uh, no. It is... it is, uh, this coming Thursday. Um, so I'm trying to do it, like, end of the month, uh, kind of last Thursday of the month. @dsegan: Beachwood. It's just outside of Cleveland. @dsegan: Uh, and, uh, you know, I... I, uh, I was the only one at the first event, uh, but, uh, I had a couple people reach out on Discord that wanted to attend. They, you know, couldn't make it or whatever. @dsegan: But it's something I want to keep going, uh, and... and, uh, keep... keep doing and, uh, you know, trying to get people to come out too, so. @NixFred: Well, we support you, brother. Uh, think that's... that's at the ner... nervous dog in Cleveland. No, in Beachwood, Ohio. @dsegan: That's right. Yes. Yes. @NixFred: Hey, man. It's always great to talk to you. We really appreciate you jump... you jumping on and coming by. @NixFred: And if you find out any other cool things to use, you know, I'm a big fan of the API, um, entry. So, uh, keep it up, brother. @NixFred: We love it. @NixFred: All right. @calledtocnstrct: All right. @NixFred: What do we... what do we got next, Joe? @calledtocnstrct: Well, uh, from a human, uh, you're... you're up next. And, you know, I just saw this post, "What if you ditched the grid and built your own life from scratch?" And at first, I thought, "What? @calledtocnstrct: What are you talking about?" And then I saw self-sufficiency and off-grid, and I'm like, "Okay. @calledtocnstrct: We got to hear I got to know what you're... you're... you're thinking about there." And, uh, you know, just, "What are you... what are you building? @calledtocnstrct: How... how are things going?" @_fromahuman_: Uh, yeah. Things are going good. Um, thanks for letting me chat, by the way, and hope everyone's having a good Sunday evening. @_fromahuman_: Um, yeah, that video speaking of, it's actually I filmed my neighbors. They're a couple of plots away. @_fromahuman_: Like, we live in, um, sort of agricultural land, a lot of trees and nature around here. So my background's in tech, actually, for about 25 years. @_fromahuman_: And in 2018, I just got sick of it and kind of just me and my wife decided to just pack up and, uh, travel a bit with our two kids. So we bought an RV and traveled Europe, went to Bali, Mexico, all over the world. @_fromahuman_: And, um, yeah, but in that time of, you know, coming from Microsoft and servers, um, so during that time from 2018, I've been learning Linux. And, um, yeah, it's been quite an adventure. @calledtocnstrct: I can imagine. Yeah. So. @calledtocnstrct: So tell... tell me about your... your vision. Like, you know, we've... we've got so much changing. @calledtocnstrct: And here you're talking about, like, you know, people being off-grid. That's a huge difference, being in tech, everything changing all at once, everywhere. @calledtocnstrct: And, you know, how... like, what do you... how do you see bridging that? And how do you see moving forward with everything happening so fast? @_fromahuman_: Well, bridging that is quite hard, isn't it? It's like two contrasting worlds, really. Um, I tried to write a tech article trying to bridge the two, but it didn't work out very well. @_fromahuman_: Sitting in nature, the laptop was a bit awkward. And there's a lot of other things to deal with, like Wi-Fi signal and batteries and all that, so. @_fromahuman_: But, um, in the beginning, it was hard. We... we basically decided to, uh, stop traveling and bought some land and lived in a tent for about a year while we saw how the land works with water and where the sun shines and where we can have garden and all that stuff. @_fromahuman_: So we actually started gardening before we even built a house. But since then, we've got a cabin, a proper solar setup. @_fromahuman_: And then, um, yeah, I mean, it's not bad. Oddly many people, but that we got friends and stuff around. @_fromahuman_: But, um, I've got some laptop set up, and I've been using Linux, and my kids have a laptop with Linux on. So as soon as I... I think it's like the third time someone mentioned Omarchy, and then I was like, "Okay. @_fromahuman_: Let me try that." So I dual-booted Windows with it, and then just immediately, like, found the experience really cool with a keyboard and a Super Key and all that, and been using it for about two or three months now. @_fromahuman_: And I've got it on all my laptops. Um, so what I've been working on is having to update each machine, like, in front of the machine, got a bit painful. @_fromahuman_: So, um, using my background in, like, networks and SCCM, where you deploy software to machines and stuff. Um, I've actually got a client and server, um, app. @_fromahuman_: I think it's more... it's going to be suited for the Omarchy server when they release their server version. So if you had a server running with this app on, and your client basically can, um, ask what operating system's running on whatever machine. @_fromahuman_: So you can get a list of machines. You can get a list of skills of machines. @_fromahuman_: You can change skills, copy skills. You know, like a connect like a orch... everyone's talking about orchestration of agents, but I think I'm looking at orchestrating the actual, like, a network of Omarchy machines using the agent, obviously, to, um, call the CLI and get all the information and do the technical stuff. @_fromahuman_: So I'm just... I've got the client server working. Um, it's a lot of testing because you have to actually try it on the different machine. @_fromahuman_: You can't let the AI do everything. So, um, yeah, like, I can call another machine's operating system. @_fromahuman_: It's only doing calls so far, so it can't actually push updates. But the next step is to do updates. @_fromahuman_: And then also have, like, a PXE boot within this, um, CLI. So if you reboot a machine or if you boot a new machine, um, there'll be a script that basically... I don't know if it's possible yet. @_fromahuman_: I have to look into it. But we'll install the agent and then give it all the details that it needs or what you want from the machines you already have. @_fromahuman_: And then, um, yeah, you basically have a machine pre-installed the way you want with your skills or that kind of stuff. That's the. @calledtocnstrct: That's really... it's really interesting because, you know, I... I see echoes throughout, uh, you know, the... the, um, history of... of the industry, uh, as far as I've been in it. And, you know, we kind of had this, uh, this innovation of virtual machines. And then at some point, somebody said, "Well, putting a virtual machine or multiple virtual machines on another operating system is just kind of wasteful. @calledtocnstrct: Why don't we just go straight to the hardware, and you can just push out virtual machines to the hardware?" And it sounds like, to a certain degree, you're... you're... you're taking this idea of, "Okay. @calledtocnstrct: I've got this Omarchy network of machines, and now let me push out AI." Um, and so not just orchestrating work that the AI's doing, but actually pushing things out to that Omarchy machine and making use of the fact that, you know, it's a malleable operating system. @calledtocnstrct: It's... it's your computer, and you can do whatever you want to with it. Is... is that kind of how you see this in... in a way? @calledtocnstrct: Like, you're bootstrapping. @_fromahuman_: Um. @calledtocnstrct: An Omarchy machine with what you want it to... to do and how you want it to function? @_fromahuman_: No, it'll be like an... an app. Well, you... you basically install the server, a CLI, right? And then. @calledtocnstrct: Yeah. @_fromahuman_: You have a client machine on your Omarchy, and from there, you could basically update another machine. So you get a list of machines on your network. You say, "Okay. @_fromahuman_: Update Omarchy," whatever the... the name of the computer is. And then, um, that... that was my first idea because I didn't want to go around clicking update on each machine, right? @_fromahuman_: So I was like, "Okay. Well, that kind of solves that problem." @_fromahuman_: And then I thought, "How else I could use it?" And I was like, "Okay. @_fromahuman_: Well, we have this .agents file, and I don't know if anyone else uses it, but, um, some of the skills that I reuse are put in there." So I could basically use the CLI to say, "Okay. @_fromahuman_: Well, copy this machine's agent skills, this and this," or a list. Actually, the server will have a list of all the skills because I'm putting that in the CLI as well, to, um, list each machine's skills, and you can basically swap between them. @_fromahuman_: Um, and eventually, like I don't know if you guys have heard of Fleet. I think it's a Linux, like, you control your Fleet. @_fromahuman_: But I... I when I found that, I was like, "Ah, shit. It's already, like, out there." @_fromahuman_: But then I thought, "Well, there's nothing really for Omarchy." So I personally didn't even look at it. @_fromahuman_: I didn't want to know about it. I didn't want to know what it does. @_fromahuman_: I wanted to build something that was in my head that I could use without having to, like, copy something else, you know? So from there, I'm just going to the more things I think of, I've already got so many things. @_fromahuman_: I'm just you need to test and check if everything works first. But, um, yeah, I think it'll be like a Fleet manager for Omarchy in a way. @_fromahuman_: But because Omarchy isn't the normal Linux, it's a bit different, so. @calledtocnstrct: Right. Right. And. @_fromahuman_: And also maybe a bridge for if you if there was some kind of bridge to connect to, um, Grokbot CLIs from two different machines, maybe that could, like, be a bridge for that. Um, so you could run commands. Instead of going through SSH, you'd just have the it's... it's going to be secured by machine ID. @_fromahuman_: So each one's got a token. So it's a unique token that authorizes against the main server. @_fromahuman_: And then also, you could, um I was thinking of, um, restricting the API calls or, like, the CLI for different so if you want an agent to only read, you the token will generate, and it'll only give access to, you know, this. Or you can have an admin AI kind of thing that'll have a different token with different access. @_fromahuman_: So it could actually write skills or update Omarchy or do different kind of things. So I want to control it with the CLI, um, as well. @calledtocnstrct: Yeah. So you're... so you're really getting down to the individual skills, not just a skill file, but actually, you know, extracting out the... the individual skills within, uh, you know, the agents and the agents MD, and then being able to manipulate those and... and kind of, uh, sculpt the landscape across the... the network of machines, it sounds like. @_fromahuman_: Yeah. Yeah. Just an easy way to get your skills across. @_fromahuman_: If you were sitting on another machine and you're like, "Ah, shit. I don't have that skill," um, you should be able to access it pretty easily, right? @calledtocnstrct: Yeah. @_fromahuman_: Um, the way I'm using AI as well is for each product project, I have a different agent because I've been orchestrating. I've tried, like, Herder, and, uh, then I moved on to Turn. And if anyone's heard of Turn, it comes with OMP and, um, an AI called KARLI. @_fromahuman_: And I tried to connect two of those from different machines, but that didn't work very well. So I'll always end up back at HERMS, um, just because you have this bridge mode with HERMS. @_fromahuman_: So you can have two HERMS running on different machines and have it, like, basically act as a gateway between the two. So you can have a chat group with bots on different machines doing local things and stuff. @calledtocnstrct: Yeah. Yeah. So the question that that brings up in my mind is and I think you might have answered it already, but you're talking about, um, you know, that you're using these different tools. @calledtocnstrct: My... my gut reaction was, "Oh, you're... you're wanting to have the... the tools kind of compete against each other," in a sense. But, um, it sounds like you're actually trying these things out and... and then finding them lacking and... and coming back to a... a tool that... that feels more like home. @calledtocnstrct: Um. @_fromahuman_: Yeah. @calledtocnstrct: Do you get a different perspective, um, in the results that you're having these agents produce by having a mixture of... of agents in the... in the system? @_fromahuman_: Yeah. Whenever I because, you know, you want to try new things out. I've... I've been trying, like, all these different things. @_fromahuman_: And it's hard to keep track of is probably the main thing. I've tried, like, an Obsidian shared notebook where they write stuff so I can keep track. @_fromahuman_: But, um, yeah, I think with HERMS, it's... it just feels different because you can have your main agent, and then it can spin up sub-agents, and those sub-agents can have certain, um, information about projects you're working on so they don't get mixed up. Or you can actually add them to chats and stuff. @_fromahuman_: They can chat to each other. But that way, the information kind of stays with that bot. @_fromahuman_: It doesn't, like, get contaminated with other projects. Because if you let one bot do everything, it's yeah, it just doesn't really work out that well. @calledtocnstrct: Tends to get, uh, you know, kind of, uh, stuck in a rut, um, potentially. I've seen that, um, with, uh, with my use, especially on, uh, local AI. @_fromahuman_: Mm-hmm. @calledtocnstrct: Yeah. That's... that's fascinating. Well, I really appreciate you sharing. @calledtocnstrct: And I think, uh, you know, I'm going to be watching for what you're... what you're working with, and especially in this realm of, like, not necessarily bridging between, you know, kind of the off-grid and the on-grid and the on-grid all the time, but, uh, how... how, you know, people can, um, you know, both be off-grid, so to speak, and... and self-sufficient, and, uh, but yet incorporating technology into what you do. And I think that's a fascinating mixture. @calledtocnstrct: So I really appreciate your, um, you know, walking us through what you're working on. @_fromahuman_: Cool. No problems. Yeah. @_fromahuman_: Um, thanks for letting me have a chat. I was meant to talk to Nyx two weeks ago, and I messed up the, um I couldn't get onto Zoom because my the... the pin they sent to my email was blocked. @_fromahuman_: So I kind of skipped that. @calledtocnstrct: Oh, that would do. @_fromahuman_: So thanks for letting me have a say hello. @calledtocnstrct: Oh, that would be great. Yeah. Let's get rescheduled, man. @calledtocnstrct: Awesome. Yeah. @calledtocnstrct: Thank you very much. So. @calledtocnstrct: Hey, let's get it rescheduled. Let's get it rescheduled, man. @calledtocnstrct: I things come up. I understand. @_fromahuman_: Yeah. No, no. It's no worries. @_fromahuman_: I'm actually busy building a house as well, so it's like, I don't spend that much time in front of the computer, if I've got to be honest. So it's... it's mostly when I do, it's productive hours. @_fromahuman_: The rest of the time, I'm either in nature or. @calledtocnstrct: Talking to me is not productive, so do something. @_fromahuman_: No. Cool. My name's Steve, by the way. @_fromahuman_: Not, um, this... this from a human was actually during COVID. It's a long story. @calledtocnstrct: That's great. Thanks, Steve. I'm Joe. @calledtocnstrct: Uh, my name, uh, is... is, uh, you know, called to construct online, but, uh, but Joe. @_fromahuman_: Joe. @calledtocnstrct: Good to meet you, Steve. Thank you very much. @_fromahuman_: Cool, man. Okay. @calledtocnstrct: Yeah. @_fromahuman_: Cheers. @calledtocnstrct: Bye. Cheers. What do you think, Joe? @calledtocnstrct: One more? Yeah. @calledtocnstrct: We've got one more, John. Uh, kick us off what, uh, what you got going on. @drxiaozhi: Hey, can you hear me? @calledtocnstrct: We hear you great, man. @drxiaozhi: Okay. Uh, I think I I'm doing some, uh, unconventional developing here. I'm trying to build a whole JavaScript stack of the, uh, the whole user space. @drxiaozhi: Uh, I'm embracing Bun, uh, the JavaScript runtime, a Node.js alternative. Uh, I'm putting it at PID1, uh, the in that system. @calledtocnstrct: All right. You're going to have to slow down a little bit. So what made you do this? @drxiaozhi: Uh, I initially, I wanted to make my code, like, across platform in a way that it's, uh, actually the same source, uh, and not that compile a binary for each platform. @calledtocnstrct: And what's the benefit to people that don't understand all that like me? @drxiaozhi: Uh, that you can, uh, use the same, like, tools on, uh, Windows, Android, Linux, and you don't need to, uh, worry about the... the size. @drxiaozhi: Because if you, uh, if you need to keep, uh, a binary for each system, it will, uh, go large, especially for, like, uh, Golang compiled, uh, binaries. @calledtocnstrct: All right. Well, what's your next steps? @drxiaozhi: Well, I mean, what's my what? @calledtocnstrct: Well, what is your next steps? Like, what do you have on your plate? Like, what are you what's the goal, and where are you going from here? @drxiaozhi: Uh, uh, this week, I'm working on, uh, rewriting QuickShell in JavaScript. Uh, and I'm trying to make as many, uh, Omarchy apps work on my JavaScript stack. @calledtocnstrct: All right. And what's your fascination with JavaScript? @drxiaozhi: Uh, I think it's the interpreted language, uh, nature. And, uh, as I mentioned, that it's, uh, the same source, uh, running on all platforms. @calledtocnstrct: Okay. I went to Java Class three times, and I misspelled it when I sent my thank-you email to the I... I tried so hard to understand Java, and I couldn't get there. Just not... not a programmer. @drxiaozhi: Uh, I'm using, uh, JavaScript and not Java. Yeah. @calledtocnstrct: Oh. See there? That... that shows you right there. @calledtocnstrct: I have no idea what I'm talking about. @drxiaozhi: Okay. @calledtocnstrct: Well, hey, man. Um, we wish you the best, and I hope that, like, come back and join us next week and, uh, tell us the... the amazing progress that you made. We're we expect, you know, huge milestones and four or five releases between now and then, at least. @drxiaozhi: Okay. Thank you. @calledtocnstrct: All right, brother. See you. @drxiaozhi: Thank you. @calledtocnstrct: Oh, thank you very much, uh, John. That was great. Nyx, Fred? @calledtocnstrct: What do you think, man? I think, uh, it's been an awesome, uh, lineup of... of people. @calledtocnstrct: Uh, my mind is stretched. Uh, I'm just so happy that, uh, I've come across this group of people and this concept. @calledtocnstrct: And, uh, I'm... I'm just I don't know where to go. Like, my brain, you know what, what you know, where are you at? @calledtocnstrct: Like, uh, we've got so much going on, so much information, but yet I feel like I'm at home here in this group. Yeah. @calledtocnstrct: And I think it's... it's because the ju there's no judgment. There's no ego. @calledtocnstrct: And even a highly, uh, opinion... let's call him opinionated person like DHH, you know, he... he's got... he's got his opinions. But I think even through his opinions, he was smart enough to know that he needs to do his best. @calledtocnstrct: And I mean do his best. And I think he is doing his best to keep the politics out of it because, you know, he certainly is political. @calledtocnstrct: But I think his leadership through this whole thing, uh, I've talked to him once or twice, um, through DMs and other methods. And, you know, he's a super smart guy. @calledtocnstrct: He's... he's, uh, got his own, you know the way I'm what I'm trying to get to is, even through his confidence, I don't think that this is I think this is much bigger than he had anticipated. Uh, I think he'll tell you that this is exactly where he thought it would be, and that's... that's great. @NixFred: But, you know, to your point, um, everybody's here to learn, you know, in other technical circles, especially on X. Uh, I kind of kept my distance because I didn't really know, you know, as much as most people on X. @NixFred: And I and that's the case here. Um, and I don't know half as much as you guys do, but the... the acceptance in the community and the, uh, the non-judgment, the no-egos, um, you know, we had Heath on here. @NixFred: The guy works on 100,000 GPUs, and he's about as humble... humble as guy that you can meet. Lee Shand on here. @NixFred: Um, he's... he's testifying and promoting and telling the world of his disability and wanting to help others. If you got Portia that's... that's leading entire segments of people that are not technical to bring them to either technology or AI or Omarchy, um, and the list goes on and on and on. @NixFred: You've got DevSec that's, like, been in the industry for 20 years, and... and there's just so many people. And if I left you out, please forgive me because every single one of you are the star of this show. @NixFred: Uh, and I know that's cheesy. Um, it... it really is true, though. @NixFred: Um, so, you know, the last thing I'll say is continue to follow everybody. Uh, I've followed everybody that I can find on here. @NixFred: I actually got rate limited. Please follow everybody. @NixFred: Um, we would love to see you next week. Uh, you know, help an old lady across the street, and when you get her there, put her... put Omarchy on her laptop. @NixFred: Back over to you, Joe, for our last goodbye. Yeah. @calledtocnstrct: Uh, or... or even potentially her cell phone in a couple weeks, right? It's, uh. @calledtocnstrct: I love that. It's coming... it's coming fast. @calledtocnstrct: Uh, but it's a... it's a beautiful thing. Uh, I never realized how locked down everything was in the computing world, and here I am writing software. @calledtocnstrct: And I... I look back and say, how... how did I contribute that to that? You know, I've been in the industry writing software. @calledtocnstrct: Um, I... I could have done something before. I could have done a lot of things before to kind of open the doors and... and let people explore. @calledtocnstrct: And, um, but everything just, um, you know, became this... this kind of like, how do I build something so that, uh, I can get customers or that I can... I can provide a service for a customer? Customer, customer, customer. @calledtocnstrct: And now we have this opportunity where somebody came along and said, you know what? And I think he even said this. @calledtocnstrct: DHH said this. I don't want another business that serves customers. @calledtocnstrct: And that is, um, again, a mind-blowing concept, to just be able to build something because it's fun, to build something because it helps somebody else, uh, and to... to build, uh, something that builds a community around it. And, you know, my... my life will never be the same, uh, again, you know, another cheesy, uh, quote to say, but it's absolutely true. @calledtocnstrct: And so hopefully everybody else is feeling that way. If you're not feeling that way, reach out to me. @calledtocnstrct: Let's talk. Um, if you're not feeling connected in this community, uh, DM me. @calledtocnstrct: You know, get let's get connected and let's talk about it because the doors have been blown wide open, and it's a beautiful thing. Uh, so thank you, everybody, for... for coming. @calledtocnstrct: And thank you, uh, Fred, for, you know, hosting. And... and you're just such a wonderful person. @calledtocnstrct: I really appreciate you. @NixFred: Ah, shucks. @NixFred: And the last thing I'll say is, you're and I'm talking to you, right? You. @NixFred: Yeah. Yeah. @NixFred: The person that's hearing. I'm talking to you. @NixFred: Your only, only limitation now is not putting it in a prompt. That's it. @NixFred: That's your limitation. So remember that. @NixFred: Everybody, have a great week. Joe, you're amazing. @NixFred: Uh, tune back in next Sunday, 3 o'clock, same time. And, uh, Wes will be back. @NixFred: And, uh, we will see you next week. Uh, DM, call to, uh, construct, Joe. @NixFred: DM me. Yeah. @NixFred: X... X won't allow me any more characters, so I had to... had to cut it short. But yeah, call to construct. @NixFred: All right. Your only limitation is not putting it in the prompt. @calledtocnstrct: Have a great week, everybody. Thank you.